MySqueezebox.com & Squeezebox Server

[itayc]

Hi all,

I have a Squeezebox Classic. Server is LMS 7.7.2 on Windows XP SP3.

The machine is configured such that drive C:, on which the OS and all programs are installed, is actually a 4GB CF card, connected to the system through a CF to IDE adapter. The D: drive, containing the music library, is a large SATA hard disk. The idea was to keep the OS and data drives separate (allowing me to easily upgrade the latter) without actually having two power-hungry hard disks. While Windows and various programs load slower than usual, most of the time this doesn't bother me as most programs are just loaded once and this is an always-on system. The memory paging file is disabled, so there are very few accesses to the CF card most of the time.

Early on I discovered that the Squeezebox server was caching its database in C: (C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Squeezebox and SqueezeCenter), slowing down the system considerably and thrashing the CF. Since I could find no way to move this directory, I used a utility from Sysinternals called Junction to remap those folders to the D: drive, so they are physically located on the hard disk.

This solved the problem until a couple of server upgrades ago (possibly 7.7.0?). Once again navigating the Music Folder has become painfully slow, and this time I have no clue why. Entering a folder containing a dozen songs can take as much as a minute. This is extremely annoying and I'd like to know if anyone has any ideas.

Thanks!

[garymc]

you can probably get more help on something unusal like this over at the user forums:

http://forums.slimdevices.com/index.php

do you get the same slowness when browsing for music using ARTIST, ALBUM, etc. (which uses the LMS database based on tags).  The LMS system is really meant to be used in that way. Browsing music folder is sort of a backup and not designed to be the main way one accesses the music.

[itayc]

I never use the browse by artist/album/genre/etc feature as it is completely irrelevant to the way my music library is structured. Much of my library is live music categorized only by folder structure, not ID3 tags, and there are several levels in the hierarchy - a simple flat list of all albums would be unusable in my scenario, so "music folder" is the way to go for me.

I did however try it now and found that these forms of browsing do not exhibit the slowdown problem at all - so the problem I describe only affects "music folder". This is beginning to look like a bug rather than a problem with my setup. (Why would the user forum be a better place to post this? I need help from the developers.)

May I add that navigation is so slow that sometimes the player just times out waiting for the server and turns off or displays "can't connect to the server". During the wait I can see that the server is running at full CPU utilization for most of the time, fairly intensive network traffic, as well as disk activity on the CF. And this is when descending into a folder with just 15 songs.

Thanks!

[garymc]

I've never seen a developer answer a question here. And there are some very knowledgable users at the other forum, including a few that are very interested in the browse music folder options. The best (only?) way to get the developers' attention is to file a bug report at:

http://bugs.slimdevices.com/

Then post a link to the bug here AND at the other forums. The bug will need a certain number of "votes" in order to get validated, and then *may* receive some developer attention.

Another approach might be to call logitech assistance, and they might eventually bump you up to a higher level of support and they might have some suggestions.

p.s. I know this is not the answer you want, but there is nothing you can't do with tags that you can do with Browse Music Folder. It is just a matter of making custom use of the tags, and perhaps installing Erland's "custom browse" plugin. I like mp3tag as very flexible tagging program (and yes, it does way more than mp3 files only).

[garymc · Accepted solution]

Another question? Have you had LMS read in your music files (clear & rescan) at some point? Even if you have no tags, it will try to guess from file/directory names.  If you haven't done this, each time you open a music directory, it is trying to add file information to its internal database, which could be taking too much time.  Just a thought. 

And I just tested on my own WIN7 machine. With about 70,000 files, mostly FLAC, I can use browse music folder and get almost instant response.  Standard sort of windows desktop with files on a "E:" drive (a eSata connected external drive). Also tried with a USB connected external drive and things were very fast with BMF.  So I'm left wondering if your drive setup may be causing the timing problem you are seeing.

[itayc]

I recall it performed a rescan on the first upgrade from SqueezeCenter to LMS. However I am going to give this a chance and rescan. This will probably take all night so I will update when the process is done.

[garymc]

Interesting that it will take all night. For example, my last clear and rescan results are below (30 minutes for 68,564 files).    With about 225,000 mp3 files I recall it is only a couple of hours or so.  So the length of scanning also points to some issues with your hardware perhaps.  Also, there have been some improvements reported in Browse Music Folder in the last few updates, so I'd also make sure I'm running LMS 7.7.2.

Discovering files/directories: E:\All Music Files   (75920 of 75920)   Complete  00:01:30

Scanning new music files: E:\All Music Files   (68564 of 68564)   Complete  00:25:21

Discovering playlists: C:\Users\XXXXX\Music\Playlists   (1 of 1)   Complete  00:00:00

Pre-caching Artwork   (3344 of 3344)   Complete  00:04:00

The server has finished scanning your media library.
Total Time: 00:30:51 (Wednesday, April 25, 2012 / 10:17 AM)

[itayc]

My server is based on a VIA pc2500e mainboard. It's a low-performance, low-power machine suited for what it does: file serving and downloading 24/7 with minimal energy usage and no fans except the power supply. So, the occasional intensive operation such as a media library refresh understandably takes longer than it would on a normal machine. It should take a few hours; the fact that it's getting late right now means I will only see the results in the morning.

And I am definitely running LMS 7.7.2 as stated in my original post. I will report on the results of the library refresh when done. Thanks a lot for your help so far!

[garymc]

some threads on the slowness of BMF on low-power servers that might be useful:

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?93815-ReadyNAS-Duo-music-folder-list-hangs&highlight=bm...

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?93594-Music-Folder-what-use-is-it&p=690616&viewfull=1#p...

[itayc]

Well, what do you know. Running a cleanup and a rescan solved the problem! I can now browse MF just fine.

Interestingly, even though LMS did run a very long rescan a couple of upgrades ago, I ran into crashes this time around, specifically with a couple of image files. I had to remove them and restart the scan to get the scan to finish. Apparently that previous rescan, while seeming like a fresh scan, was not. Anyway, where could I post the bad images so the developers can fix the bug? I can't attach files here.

Also, a question about something you wrote: "If you haven't done [a clean rescan], each time you open a music directory, it is trying to add file information to its internal database, which could be taking too much time." Is this true even if I re-enter the same directory several times? Because the slowdown surely happened regardless of how many times I tried to enter the same directory. If your theory was correct, the slowdown would only have happened the first time I entered a certain directory. Or did I misunderstand something?

Thanks once again for your help!